All pretty straight forward

Patricia · All pretty straight forward

This was my first litter docked under the new law Crying or Very sad

I will say it is all very straight forward...My vet insisted on a little pain killer injection before docking at 2 days. Mum came with the pups and all went back suckling without as much as a squeak.
I filled in the form which was to be completed when the pups were all microchipped. The vet sees the shot gun licence, stamps the form and finished.
Yesterday, the pups were duly microchipped at 7 weeks. I took my tattoo form with their number, KC reg etc...We matched the tattoo number with the chip and registered name. Very easy.
2 forms, one for owner, 1 to send. All with prepacked envelopes. And a little tag.
Now ...Gone are the days when puppies went with KC reg and pedigree.
I have with each:
1 tattoo form , 2 microchips forms, 1 pet plan insurance slip, pedigree, KC reg, puppy diet, tag, 3kgs Proplan, endorsement form, receipt and worming info. I think that is it. Rolling Eyes

My vet laughed and commented no way will those babies get lost Wink

Not complicated, and all get a vet check thrown in with it.
I was worried about it all, there really was no need. A good vet is really an asset Very Happy

guy

Pleased to hear that news. Was there a cost premium over the cost pre docking ban?

Patricia

My pups were " banded" before as I prefered that method.
The cost is basically £ 40 for pup including docking and microchipping.I did not have the Thermo chip as it is £37 instead of the £20 basic one.
Cheap not to have to have a tail Rolling Eyes

As I have said many times, I prefer the tattoo. And my name will always be on the register. And all you need is to lift the ear.
I might add that I have an excellent vet who has done some pretty complicated ops on my dogs at times( one being rewiring my dog's jaw, and my old bitch's cruciate)
She is one of those you wished was your doctor.
She even spotted her husband's break in the neck on the Xray- The French had missed it!- whilst skiiing... Idea

ID Girl · Re: All pretty straight forward

Mugi

Will add one more thing you send your pups with Patricia (pertinent in light of an email I received today from Freddy's breeder)...........a genuine interest and concern for 'your' babies.

Patricia

How did you get on with your Welshie's breeder, Sue? Any joy...It must be devastating to find you have bred something who will be affected... Crying or Very sad

How will this condition affect him later? Just curious...

Mugi

Well, basically she isn't interested. I will email you a copy of what I sent her and her reply but won't do it on an open forum as it could get nasty.

Suffice to say Fred's sisters owner and I are not letting things rest as we feel the sibling owners have a right to know.

The upshot for Fred is he has a pretty high chance of losing both his eyes - the pain associated with the condition means removal of the eye is the best option but obviously that is devastating as it happens quickly so no chance to learn blindness and both eyes are equally affected.

The treatment he is now on may help keep the condition at bay, and at least he has no fear for his future as he doesn't know the results of his tests.

Patricia

I'll put a response in the relevant section! Confused

sallie

i am a little confused here...

IF i saw a litter of pups none that had been docked, but i wanted a docked pup for hunting purposes - do i have to prove it is for hunting before it can be docked? I no longer use a gun, so no license, how would i prove it was for hunting? Or is it down to the breeder, if they refuse to have it docked does it then boil down to me when i take charge of the pup - 6 wks too old i would have thought to have a dog docked

Basic question i know, but i am getting bogged down with all the new laws and legislation.

Patricia

It is down to the breeder to have the puppies docked.
You need a shot gun licence( which we obviously have as we shoot and use guns for pest control, ie rabbits and pigeons)- which plague us-
or you can have a letter from ie a shoot where you might be beating... or another such letter from the landowner showing you work the dog on their land.
It is up to the breeder therefore to have the pups docked( no later than 3 days) and do all the relevant and legal paperwork.
The most difficult is finding a vet who will dock and understands working dogs. I can assure anyone than having had pups docked for a good many years now, there is little to it. At that age the bone is pretty thin in a Brittany's tail, not like a Rottie.
Each owner is provided with a " legal form " stamped by the vet. Simple.
It is up to the future buyer to see if he/she wants a tail or not. and to find such a breeder.
Most of my pups went to people who either are going to work them or did not want a tail.

guy

http://www.defra.gov.uk/animalh/welfare/act/docking.htm

doganjo

The alternative is to book a pup from a breeder who owns correctly conformed breeding dogs with the short tail gene, and hope that at least one of the pups is born short-tailed. But as I tried to explain in another thread(rather unsuccessfully it would seem Wink

) the tails can virtually be any length. And not all tail-less or bobtailed dogs produce their like. My friend Cecilie in Sweden has 8 pups, born to a tail-less bitch sired by a docked dog (Flash) and every one has a full length tail. So good old Mother Nature plays a big part in all of this, and upsets teh statistics yet again. Almost all dogs bred by Cissi are worked and in fact trialled. The terrain is not so very different from here in Scotland - heavy brushland, dense woodland, thick heather moors, and she says that the tails are an advantage since the handler can 'read' the dog more accurately and see where they are. She has never had any tail damage.
Playing Devil's Advocate (yet again) some would say that a working Brittany is at no more risk of tail damage than a pet one, because they hunt all cover regardless of whether the owner is shooting, beating, picking up, or just out for a country walk. I prefer bobtails but just for the look rather than any other reason. To me they look like small munsterlanders or sometimes setters with tails. JMHO
Annie

sallie

I can read Monets tail - round and round very fast means ... i'm onto something - straight out ... its here - up in the air, i'm large and in charge Laughing

Not sure whether or not i would get another tailless, it was an 'IF' question. All my spaniels have been docked, Poppy being a cross breed wasn't, however i have had to go in undergrowth to free her caught tail many times as she loves to hunt Evil or Very Mad

still, i do like the look of an undocked working dog, as you say it adds to body language.

Patricia

Well you could always shave its tail!
For me, and me only, had I wanted a tailled dogs I would not have got a Brittany. I have grown up with these dogs, the short tail enhances the Cob look with its nice round bum, a tail looks" stuck on".
It is OK for a longer backed dog as it is balanced.
I went to see my Bouvier breeder who now have their appendage...curled over the back. They are simply horrible Crying or Very sad

as the Bouvier is also a square dog...

Jayne Cutler

What happens when a docked puppy is owned or sold to a person as a pet?

Jayne

doganjo

I don't think there is any difference between one sold as a pet and one sold to a working home. Both need a vet certificate if they have been docked. In England and Wales all docked pups need a certificate from the vet and chipped. The rule is just that the bitch owner has the criteria to allow the pups to be docked, not the prospective owner - that's not liekly to be possible since not all pups are sold at 2/3 days when docking needs to be done. That's my understanding anyway. In Scotland, we have to get a vet's certificate to the opposite - that the pups have NOT been docked where they are natural short tails. I think that would only apply to pups with fairly short tails up to a medium length, but not the longer type tails without being full length - but I'm not absolutely sure. There's a story going about that docked dogs need a PTS (permission to show) from the KC in order to be shown. I presume that means only dogs born after the date of implementation of the respective Acts. It's such a mess that I can see there being a good few test cases to establish Law precendents.
Annie

guy

From the KC advice page

Patricia

What a mess... Evil or Very Mad

doganjo

Anyone can ask the KC things like that so I suggest you go ahead, Guy, and let Gay know the outcome There is a facility to email them on a form on their website. I am sure the KC will be pleased that as a Club we want to do things properly.
Annie

Ghilliegumdrop

Are you saying that it's the CLUB that wants to do things properly.....in the light of recent goings on I would query if that is correct Exclamation

Patricia

I think this is going to be the end of the conversation Rolling Eyes

How do we all get bogged down by all these rules Question

Reading Dog World is all very depressing this week. End of hunting( well it still goes on somehow Wink

) docking, now pedigree dogs, when will all these control freaks finish...and at what?
Take rescue dogs instead. What next? I have come across some poor people trying to do a good deed by taking on such a dog... and ending up nervous wrecks themselves by the " other" problems they encounter, not physical always but...mental. Embarassed

sallie

'Too many cooks' come to mind with all the legislation, the question is - is it good for the dog... only time will tell, but lets hope so, after all, a dog is more than just a tail!

As for the CLUB ... well lets just not go there, as my opinion will offend Laughing

guy

1. I will pursue the reprinting - i think the article needs to be brought to the attention of the widest audiencde
2. no end to conversation - these subjects need to be discussed so they can be understood.

guy

Please could posters refrain from using the word CLUB when meaning a single or few individuals. There are 300+ bona fide members of the club.

May I remind forum members that comment on individual behaviour does not have a place on this public forum - it could be considered libelous.

Please re read http://thebrittanyforum.myfreeforum.org/sutra11075.php#11075

Mugi

Can the topic be split? I think Patricia's origin post regarding how straightforward it was to get her litter docked deserves to stand alone as a reference. The other discussion may be better viewed as a separate topic?
JMHO

Patricia

You are right Sue...
Nothing much to add. We are stuck with it, there will be people who have tails and the ones who don't want them. Confused

It certainly looks as if many future owners who work their dogs- but not all- would rather the dog docked.
Life is a choice. It is good to have such freedom.
I read an excellent article by David Hancock, stating that all breeds were made for a job, and now, we want to take their instincts away. Some want to have sighthounds but not let them stretch their legs etc...
As long as we retain the dual purpose nature of the Brittany, tail or not tail, then... that is what is important. Wink

Ghilliegumdrop

Sorry Guy I thought it was more ambiguous like that.....am I being watched now Question

guy

Ghilliegumdrop

Oh drat.....and heres me thinking I was going to be famous Twisted Evil

johnhod

guy

only 9" between a halo and a noose Laughing

Ghilliegumdrop

I'm Royalty so it would be the Sword Twisted Evil

sallie

A moment of madness and i apologise to the CLUB for my previous comments on this thread Embarassed

eddieh

guy

doganjo

Definition of Club
Association, Society, guild, organisation, union, alliance, fellowship, beat, hit, bludgeon, bash, batter, smash, bang, strike, bat, stick, cudgel, weapon

In our leisure we reveal what kind of people we are. (Ovid)

Woody Allen once said " I'd never join a club that would allow a person like me to become a member"

Makes you wonder, doesn't it?

guy

Lin Dyke

The club is made of many people and no one person is greater than the club.

doganjo

Perhaps a new thread for quotes is in order?

Ghilliegumdrop

Like the moon they are all waxing poetical.........or is it waning Question

guy

I think this thread has proved that a forum can be self policing Laughing

Personal thanks to all.

Ghilliegumdrop

My son-in-law is a policeman Twisted Evil

doganjo

So's my lovely new next door neighbour's son Wink

Ghilliegumdrop

Never mind swanning around on here go and look at your emails and then give me a ring Rolling Eyes

All pretty straight forward

Re: All pretty straight forward