dodgy hip????

Waldo · dodgy hip????

Hi All,
My girl Annie has been to the vet today and is booked in to go in on Tuesday for a heavy sedation, some further examination and some xrays.
She has been favouring her left rear leg for a few weeks, seems to walk OK, and runs Ok but when at mid-pace she will lift the rear left and hop for a few paces then get back into stride. I haven't worried about it too much because she has been running and walking OK.
She came out hunting last weekend and it didn't seem to bother her too much, yesterday we went out hunting but at a property where the ground is quite dry and hard without any leaf litter type material to soften the blow and she came home a bit lame.
After examination today the vet was talking about possible hip problems in the joint, I really don't know what to think. We've put in close to 2 years of work together and are just starting to see the rewards and looking forward to spending time in the field hunting and now this happens.
Has anybody seen similar symptoms to what Annie is showing?
Cheers,
Waldo

Victoria

Waldo, I have seen a dog do that, and if memory serves me correctly I am sure it may have been the cruciate (sp??????) ligament...

Ghilliegumdrop

Slipping patella Question

Or it could just be that she trod on something that has made her foot sore or pulled a muscle.

sallie

Hi, Monet does the back leg hop thing... i put it down to when he broke his foot and sometimes it becomes tender, so would like to hear how you get on at the vet... It never occurred to me something else could be wrong.

doganjo

Hopping on a rear leg or putting it straight out behind is a fairly sure sign of slipping patella. I have seen this in a friend's springer but never experienced it, so I'm quoting from books here. The knee usually slips back into place again fairly quickly though, and although it looks scary only the most severe cases appear to be in pain. They can operate to regroove the bone and it has a fairly high success rate - 80% I believe. But there is a pretty severe cage rest period afterwards for a few weeks. Your vet should have all the details but you can google it. It can be hereditary but it can also be caused by trauma. If it only happens infrequently vets sometimes just treat the symptoms to save putting the dog through a major operation.

Patricia

Also sounds to me like a case of slipping Patella. I have seen it, as well as cruciate( which is more drastic as it can snap) It can also be due to injury...The op is needed and months of cage rest folllowed by limited and on lead exercise. Otherwise the whole thing could be a failure. It is then vital to follow that strict exercise regime. Crying or Very sad

Waldo

Well I picked Annie up from the vet this afternoon and the news is not good, she has hip dysplasia!
Severely dissapointed is probably an understatement, not real sure what to think, we've got thru the puppy stage, got training under control (I think) and this happens, my wife even likes her most of the time!
The vet has started her on a course of injections to help, but I guess the future is a bit uncertain for us.
I really don't want to hold back on the training and field work too much as she just loves it, might just have to moderate things a bit and see how she goes. Being fairly lightly built, currently 18.1kg perhaps it might work in her favour, I hope so.
Cheers,
Waldo

Patricia

This is why many in France( and elsewhere) do the hip scoring at one year of age; when you think of the money and investment spent on Professional training for some of those dogs...is huge.
Your vet will direct you towards the best course of action for Annie. Sorry to hear the bad news. Sad

doganjo

Waldo, I am so sorry to hear this. There are varying degrees of hip dysplasia and the causes are not always just down to inheritance. The degree of Annie's dysplasia will determine the treatment. Hip scores in the Uk are marked as being from zero each side(no dysplasia) to 53 each side (indicating severe dysplasia)
18kg seems heavy for a bitch unless she is tall - what height is she? If she is about 50 cms it might be OK but if around 47 to 48 she should be in the region of 16 to 17 kgs IMO.

Has she perhaps had too much exercise over rough ground as a puppy? I don't remember what age she is now. That can affect the hips too.

either way it seems she won't be able to do a great deal of work if dysplasia has been diagnosed so young. It is very sad and proves that hip scoring does at least help towards eliminating this dreadful disease, provided breeders do not breed with high scoring dogs.
I do hope you manage to keep her pain free. My best wishes to you and your wife and wee Annie.

sallie

Very sorry to hear this Waldo, being new to the breed the outcome has taken me by surprise as its the first case i have read about. I'm sure Annie will live a very active and happy life, no matter what you decide for her future.

Waldo

Hi All, still a bit shell shocked really.
Jo, Annie is just over 21 months old and build wise is probably on the shorter side in regards to height but is definately not over weight, with the exception of this hip thing I would say she is in pretty good condition.
I did all the right things to start with, she comes from a good pedigree, went thru the puppy officer from the breed club over here and she came from a breeder who loves their dogs.
Exercise wise when young I was carefull not to do too much with her to give her a chance to grow and gain strength. I guess it all boils down to sometimes sh*t happens, dissapointing to the extreme.
Short term at least I've decided to keep going with the injection treatment and possibly modify the field work to keep her real close at heal to limit the miles she does. I really don't want to see her waste away in the yard and want to spend the time while she can doing what she/we want to do - hunting.
Longer term don't really know what to expect.
Cheers,
Waldo

gundoglover

Waldo,

I would get a second opinion. As I recall, you are in a rural area so your vet may be a pet vet, not a breeder vet. I once had a pet vet tell me my dog (different breed) who was limping had hip dysplasia when he x-rayed the hips. I went to a different vet recommended by breeders, had the dog x-rayed properly (the position makes a difference to how well the hip joint can be seen) and scored by an accredited vet - the hip score was 1:1 (which strictly speaking is hip dysplasia because it's not 0:0, but a very good hip score and unlikely to cause limping). The limping turned out to be a tear in the cruciate (probably from leaping from the bank into a river where the water was low). It was suggested that I take him to a greyhound specialist for treatment. It took six weeks of rest and separation from the other dogs and supervised on-lead swimming and heat treatment before the limping was cured.

Patricia

Gundoglover, that is very good advice....

Waldo

Thanks for the advice, I did see the xrays and the difference in the hips was noticeable to my untrained eye. They did give me a "spare" xray to keep and while not as good as the ones the vet kept it's not too bad. My boss' wife is a vet (not currently practicing) so I may ask if she could cast her eye over the xray I have and put her 2 cents worth forward. If she thinks it's worth while having herself or another vet do an examination I'll give it a go.
Thanks,
Waldo

doganjo

If you can scan it in and it comes up reasonably clear you could send it to Anne Eissing as her husband Andreas is I believe a vet.

gundoglover

Waldo,

The positioning of the hips when they are x-rayed can make a BIG difference. I would seriously consider going to a vet who specializes in hip x-rays to have the x-rays done again or at least tell you if the hips are correctly positioned on the x-ray you have. If the hips are poorly positioned, it is a waste of time having them scored.

I drive 200 km to go to an expert vet for hip & elbow x-rays. The local pet vets just don't have the expertise in this specialist field. Given that you want to hunt this dog and have invested time in her training, it is worth the extra expense to make sure.

If you log on to the forum at www.dogzonline.com.au and ask breeders there, they will be able to recommend a good vet near you for hip x-rays.

Wyngold

I am hoping that the shots being given to your dog is
"Adequan" a glycosaminoglycan injection to help regenerate the
cartilage in the joint? I hope they are not using Steroids as this will aggrevate the bone over a long period of time.
You can also provide dietary Glucosamine and Hyaluronic Acid in liquid molecular form to help alleviate some of the symptoms and basically keep her on it for life. If you can find an Equine product in liquid it should work well.

One thing for sure if she is exhibiting pain now then you will definately have to adjust her exercise and modulate her weight downwards.
Swimming is a good exercise as it is not weight bearing and helps to maintain the muscle tone which is very important.

Waldo

The injections are "pentosan" which will be a series of four injections followed up latter with another series when needed, etc, etc.
I'm going to monitor everything closely and as said before modify how I work her and see how it goes.
Surgery options were discussed for if/when things get too bad for her but don't want to go down that path because it all sounds a bit too extreme.
Not sure what to expect but in the short term at least we've got some hunting to do.
Cheers,
Waldo

Wyngold

Good deal sounds like your Vet is up todate on treating Osteoarthritis !

Waldo

Went back to the vets yesterday for Annie's 4th pentosan injection and a follow up consultation. The vet was feeling her back legs and couldn't identify by feel which leg had the issue, so she has put muscle back on the left leg where originally it was a bit wasted. This appears (to me at least) to be a good sign, the favouring of the back leg is bit less pronounced and not as regular as it was previously so hopefully we can manage the situation. Annie will be due for her regular vaccinations in June so I'll be back at my more regular vet for those and he can have a good look at her xrays and check her out so I can have a second opinion. Meanwhile next weekend looks like we'll (son & I) have a 150 target skeet shoot then the following weekend the 3 of us have an "appointment" with a stag we saw/heard last week.
Cheers,
Waldo

gundoglover

Sounds like a good outcome. I hadn't realised from your earlier postings that Annie's leg muscle had actually wasted. What a relief to have her so improved. Good luck with the skeet & the stag.