I personally have owned Bobtails and "no tails" whatever you like to call it.( in 22 years in the breed)
Mine have never been affected in any way. Nor did I have any trouble mating bobtail to bobtail some years back before I knew this was an" issue"
I certainly would have noticed it as many stayed local to me.
I have heard of trouble in a few and have seen a Brittany in the ring move as if it was lame.
I feel it would be interesting to ask Anka from Switzerland who lately mated bobtail to bobtail, had 8 puppies, imports and uses Tailless stock from France regularly...
We also ought to have a database showing the problems if some occur, numbers of puppies, lenght of tails etc...
Seems to me if the KC will be documenting the gene on pedigrees that doing so no matter the length of the effected short tail would be of benefit to avoid breeding short to short if one wanted to minimize the homozygous effects like lack of anus that I encountered when my supposed long tail was mated to a bobtail. When one encounters such results you can document now in fact that the supposed long tail was in fact a carrier of the gene.
The KC will ONLY append the word 'BOBTAIL' to a registration, and ONLY if certified by a Vet using that particular word. They will not annotate ANY other length of tail, nor the word 'tail-less'. They are NOT documenting the gene on the registration system if they do this. I have advised them also that Vet decisions may not be reliable. My own vet of considerable stature and experience, and who is in favour of docking although we cannot do so in Scotland, was unable to determine which if either of my girls was a natural bobtail. In fact he would have certified Freckles as such, and said she had virtually no tail at all. I have come to the conclusion, that this decision by the KC on recording bobtails is therefore of questionable value to our breed, since it might be possible for non-bobtails to be registered as carrying the gene.
Annie
Annie _________________ Annie
Handle every situation like a dog, if you can't eat it or play with it, just pee on it and walk away
Well in the 32+ years I have been breeding Brittanys in the dogs that have naturally very very short or no tails their gaits can be affected.
It is not sure that in all cases this is so but certainly in several dogs there can be nerve intervention issues "cauda equina syndrome".
In my own natural bobtail which by the way the breeder was positive they had no natural short tailed pups....what made me suspicious about him was that he had a tendency ot "throw" one leg a bit wildly when he trotted or galloped. I also from palpation detected a flabby tail skin that came to a point and with NO scar of any kind to indicate banding or cutting.
He is OFA Good hips, elbows, and patellae normal. These observations made me inquire and on all accounts they told me no. Well bred for the first time he produced a litter of 3 pups out of a bitch that came from a litter of 8....with proper timing and all. 2 of the pups were bobtail, one of which was born without an Anus... so it lead me to also identify the bitch as also a bobtail even though I whelped her and docked her as a puppy.
She had a rather "thick" tail root compaired to the more whispey tail of
the littermates, but it did not appear shorter in length in any way.
Since one will not "imporve" the numbers of bobtails produced since they are ALL heterozygous then it makes no sense to deliberately breed bobtail to bobtail IMHO. All it will do is likely increase the number of potential hindqtr. defects. One can tell if a tell was cut, banded or not from a dog that was born that way....at least I have been able to tell in the dogs that I have been around and actually "really" examined.
Of course unless one continually breeds through many many repeats one may not see all of the statistical effects, and since the lethality should be in utero one hopes that you would not see the defects that I have over the years on occasion.....they are not pretty.
What might be of interest is how does one harness the unidentified gene in Bulldogs and Boston Terriers that is not a dominant gene and not the same gene as found in Brittanys???? seems this gene even if it produces a slight kink is recessive and needs to be homozygous in nature to have a true breeding trait.
Considering how the sable gene got into the breed it would certainly be interesting to see if one could get the "other" bobtail gene......)) _________________ Goldie Coats
Wyngold Britanys
Bend, OREGON, USA
So Goldie, you would be happy for tailed dogs I guess? As I mentionned before, everyone to their own. If people are happy with tails, that is fine. But I choose not to have one at home, just like Anka
I would be happy to leave tails if I am told the sex, colour and get the full payment, considering there will be no choice at 2 days
I do not plan to breed bob to bobs, and will make sure I give Anne all my details on the litter from my tailless bitch. She happens to have bloodlines which are different to my others, which is another reason why I bought her. ( several of my Brittanys have Crak behind them). She has a little tail, unlike my old male who had nothing at all. And he moved well.
No I am not happy to "have" tails I am just one who wants a healthy litter without having to put them down because of a known genetic defect that I intentionally caused. Now if I could convince a genetic experiment along the lines of Dr. Cattinach's Boxer one but instead use the recessive gene which would allow us to have 100% bobtails with no effect other than a slightly kinked tail I am all for it. But for now having a gene that is not 100% true breeding means to be stuck in breeidng tailed to no tail to get some tailess that are healthy.....that is all.
But for now I live where I can dock, and you can besure that when the time comes with genetics articles such as this I would intend to make it or keep it legel for the breeds that do have such genes to keep them docked under specific regulations and guidelines for proceedures. _________________ Goldie Coats
Wyngold Britanys
Bend, OREGON, USA
Titan des Deux Moulins, OFA Good, patellae Normal, Tailess
(Ch-A,P,T Fanch de Saint Lubin x Paula des Deux Moulins)
and
Ululani du Petit Odon, OFA Good, patellae Normal
(Phenix du Bosquet de la Mordoree,Tr x Polden du Petit Odon)
Had 6 pups- 3 males (1 tailess) & 3 Females (1 very small may not make it)
So for now Titan has only produced 3 tailess pups in 2 breedings. Not a very high chance probability eh? _________________ Goldie Coats
Wyngold Britanys
Bend, OREGON, USA
The rumpy Manx cat has what the breed's fanciers call a bear/rabbit type gait...he runs as if the pelvis and hips are as one. I personally believe that this, what I call 'fixing' of the pelvis is what is causative in the rumpies being predisposed to megacolon as kittens, which, thankfully under sound, experienced husbandry can be avoided.
I would be most interested in knowing if anure Breton puppies have any predisposition to this condition. _________________ "...amitie, respect mutuel et amour..."
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